DOLCI!
Talking With Italian-American Baker and Ciao, Gloria Owner Renato Poliafito About His New Cookbook and a Recipe for a Beat-the-Heat Peaches and Cream Semifreddo
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Dolci!
Renato Poliafito is one of my favorite people in the New York food world, and on a regular basis I take two buses from my place in Brooklyn Heights to Prospect Heights to visit his acclaimed Brooklyn cafe and bakery Ciao, Gloria to load up on Italian American inspired specialities. I’ve known the two-time James Beard Award nominee since his years at Baked, the Red Hook, Brooklyn, bakery he co-founded with Matt Lewis that specialized in Americana-inspired brownies, cupcakes, layer cakes, cookies, and more. And while he and Lewis co-authored four bestselling cookbooks together, Poliafito considers his new book, Dolci!: American Baking with an Italian Accent, his first “solo album.”
And the pending release of his new cookbook isn’t the only thing Renato will be celebrating. October 1st marks the fifth anniversary of Ciao, Gloria, so stay tuned for what I’m sure will be a sweet celebration.
“Renato Poliafito hits the sweet spot in Dolci!, with favorite desserts from his popular (and my favorite) bakery in Brooklyn—Ciao, Gloria. He turns his years of baking experience and his Italian American heritage into reimagined rainbow cookies (a cake, Spumoni Loaf!), Amaretto Caramel Brownies, and a bitter/sweet Chocolate Amaro Pecan Pie, as well as savory snacks for aperitivo. Grazie mille to Renato for sharing this outstanding collection of recipes, so anyone . . . and everyone, can make them at home.”
—David Lebovitz, author of My Paris Kitchen and Drinking French
Written with Casey Elsass and featuring photography by Kevin Miyazaki, Dolci! captures the flavors of la dolce vita from Brooklyn to Bologna, celebrating Italian American (and truly Italian and all-American) baking traditions. Among the many sweet and savory recipes you’ll find Panettone Bread Pudding, Aperol Spritz Cake, Cacio e Pepe Arancini, Malted Tiramisu, Spumoni Loaf, an Amaro Root Beer Float, and more.
I was lucky to be privy on Renato’s journey working on Dolci!, often seeing him in his little office just off the bakery case at Ciao, Gloria marking up his manuscript while on yet another deadline. And he shared the mood board with me after he turned in the proposal and let me see an early photo layout, with so many beautiful scenes of traveling through Italy, from Sicily to Milan. And I even made the Acknowledgements for an assist when it came to all things amari and bitters for the handful of drinks featured in the book.
I recently had the chance to sit down with Renato on a sunny and busy morning at Ciao, Gloria to learn more about Dolci!. Read on as we talk about growing up as a second-generation Italian American, how he fell in love with Italian food and culture, his favorite region in Italy to visit, behind-the-scenes on creating Dolci!, being prepared to hear what Italian nonnas might say about his new cookbook, a hint at a new, in-the-works business venture, and a perfect-for-summer recipe for Peaches and Cream Semifreddo.
Talking with Renato Poliafito
Italian Heritage and a Tale of Two Identities
Your father arrived in Brooklyn from Sicily in 1957, later joined by your mother and newborn sister, settling in Queens. You write about being the youngest of three siblings and being the most Americanized of them all. But you also got to spend a lot of time in Sicily. Did you ever feel left out or wish you had embraced learning and speaking Italian more at a young age?
Renato: Oh, definitely. My parents didn't put a lot of pressure on me to speak Italian, but to understand it. So my comprehension level is close to a hundred percent. But I wish they kind of put a little more pressure on me to speak it more. I was a little apprehensive as a kid because of that duality, the fact that I was Italian and American, but my life and my culture was really Americanized. It wasn't until later that I was like, you know, it would've been great great if I was bilingual.
But when you were back in Sicily and attending middle school there your lack of Italian fluency obviously hindered you, right?
Renato: I was completely ostracized and treated like I was kind of an idiot. I was pretty smart in American schools but then I was thrown into an Italian school where I didn’t understand anything that was going on. Not only the curriculum, but the social norms and how to act. And also being a young gay guy and having this kind of anxiety. I mean, you don’t know, but you know something is different. But you can’t put your finger on it. You feel like you’re different. You kind of blame it on a bunch of things and then you realize, oh, I am different. But that came way later.
And your true love of Italy wasn’t born through Italian food but through Italian art?
Renato: Yeah. I was an art major in college and did time abroad in Florence where I studied Renaissance art. That’s when I started to learn to love the culture, and understand the culture. Previously all my exposure to Italy had been through Southern Italy via a small town in Sicily. Sicily is definitely having a moment right now, and there are beautiful parts, but as a kid there with my parents they would go back to Sicily and just settle into a very boring life. There was nothing exciting about it. So I would just either be at home or at my aunt's house or just wandering around the park with nothing to do. So when I went to Florence, it just, it kind of changed things. It opened up these doors where I was just like, oh, this is a very cool country and the food is delicious and there's so much art and culture. My eyes just kind of opened up.
You note in Dolci! that this book isn't influenced about growing up at the apron of an Italian nonna, but you do dedicate the book to your mother. Could you tell me about her and her influence on you, either as a person or, ultimately, as a baker?
Renato: My mom was what you’d call a casalinga, a housewife. She cooked and she cleaned and she kept an immaculate home. She kind of took me under her wing and taught me everything she knew in terms of how to run a house. But cooking was basically her domain. I could watch and maybe assist here and there. But she let me help when it came to baking. She had a repertoire of four or five things she would bake. She was making S cookies, almond cookies, olive oil cake, a variety of bundt cakes, a few fruit-based things—something orange, something lemon—and occasionally a chocolate cake, though she wasn’t a big fan of chocolate. My most vivid memories are her S cookies and olive oil buns.
Did she embrace Italian American food or still cooking what she made back in Italy?
Renato: It was pretty much 99% Italian, but she was amazed by American food—it was so exotic to her. She loved making pasta salads and when I was a teenager when we moved to Florida she was heavily influenced by one of our neighbors who taught her how to make cream cheese mashed potatoes with scallions and Shake ‘n Bake style chicken breast. And chili! And there was a big shepherd’s pie phase. And there was still pasta, of course. My dad always needed pasta. Pasta was always first.
Is mom still with us?
Renato: Yes. She’s 91 and lives in Florida.
God bless her. I love this quote in the book about you wrestling with your identity as an Italian American: “Although I love Italy with all my heart, I’ll always be an American looking in. And although New York will always be my home, there’s a small piece of me that knows I’m from someplace else. My Italian identity lives alongside my American one, and in a weird twist of fate, I’ll never fully be either.” I’m not saying you’re Tom Ripley, but you live with these different split identities never feeling 100% in either place.
Renato: It’s something I’ve dealt with a lot but it’s just part of my identity now. I don’t really wrestle with it anymore, it’s just this is who I am. If I go to Italy, I’m an American, and when I’m here I’m often viewed as an Italian. With everything I do there’s an influence from another culture. The one thing that kind of always triggers me and has followed me throughout adulthood was trying to get an Italian citizenship because my parents are from Sicily. But I can't become an Italian citizen because they gave up their American citizenship in the sixties. They became American citizens but in the nineties when Italy let people who had given up their Italian citizenship to become Italian citizens again they reapplied and became Italian citizens. I can't ever become an Italian. Well, I can, but I would have live there for two years, not get a job, and go through the whole process.
When you go back to Italy now what’s your favorite region to visit and what makes it special to you?
Renato: I’ve been to most of the regions in Italy but I fell in love with Puglia about 10 or 12 years ago. It’s beautiful, it’s peaceful, and it’s not a road well-traveled by Americans—yet. Though I see more and more of us whenever I’m there. Bari is such a cool city. Brindisi is also really nice, and there’s Lecce, Monopoli, and Ostuni, which is a very popular destination. It’s just beautiful. It feels like… I described it once like if Greece and Italy had a baby, it would be Puglia. It has a bit of that influence in terms of the architecture and its whitewashed and arid. You’re on a peninsula surrounded by the sea. It’s just beautiful.
Adopting and Adapting Italian Culture in America
Years ago I interviewed a very famous (and now cancelled) Italian American, New York City-based chef, who was a knowledgable proponent for Italian culture and cuisine but always said that Italy suffered when it came to their desserts—that they weren’t the sort of closers you craved or of the same quality of, say, French desserts. Would you agree?
Renato: Well, Italian desserts are simple and they rely heavily on the same ten ingredients. I think all of Italy relies on a very simple base of ingredients, and they make wonderful things with those base ingredients. But yeah, I find when it comes to dessert it does kind of limit things. But with Italians, if it ain't broke… you know what I mean? And they don't consider anything broken. So the desserts kind of go through this rotation where each region has its own variations of the same dessert. And that was the biggest challenge with writing this book. I wasn't expecting to encounter that. I wasn't expecting to have almost every region have very similar desserts that each lay claim to it. It’s called one thing in this region and another thing in another region. So finding the truth and digging in to discover the origin of something was next to impossible.
Some examples are the maritozzi, which is a simple but classic Roman dessert. A brioche stuffed with cream. Then you have the cassata, typically Sicilian, and Minne di Sant'Agata from Catania. Then you have panzerotti. They all have their regions. But then you’ll find pastry cream with Amarena cherry in a frolla dough, and there are a million variations of that thing all over Italy. It was difficult to figure it all out. I may be right on most of it, I may be wrong on some of it. And if I am I’m sure I’ll hear about it.
Most Italians, as you know, are obsessed with their rituals and beliefs surrounding food and drink. Are there any particular Italian rituals you've observed or admire when it comes to baked goods?
Renato: I’m not a big savory person so I’m steadfast to that ritual of coffee and pastry in the morning. If I’m just waking up and I have to eat something it’ll be a sweet little pastry of some kind. A little slice of torta or a biscotti. That’s where I kind of live.
And what’s your personal coffee ritual?
Renato: I do a little bit of everything. I make my own cappuccino in the morning here [Ciao, Gloria] and that’s my first coffee drink of the day. If I have a day off, which is super rare, I have a Moccamaster at home, and I’ll make myself an American coffee. I also have a Nespresso that I’ve recently fallen in love with because I bought all the pods in Italy and brought them back home with me. They feel a little more genuine. I’ll pull myself a little cortado if I’m in a rush. I also love a French press. I love my Moka pot. My mom taught me how to make coffee for her before she got up in the morning when I was very young—like five. She used an electric percolator. She did Moka pots after dinner and we would have a little espresso. Coffee has always been a part of my life.
I particularly appreciate how Italians approach sweets as part of their daily routine, but in moderation.
Renato: I feel like it’s a more healthy approach in Italy, incorporating a little sweet treat for yourself.
Are there any Italian sweets or pastries you wish we’d adopt stateside?
Renato: We already know about the mainstays. A lot of the Italian desserts here have Southern Italian roots, but there are some great Northern Italian desserts. I love a crostata. It’s such a simple pastry and it’s so delicious—it’s surprising you don’t see more of them here. Just a classic, simply made crostata with apricot or some other jam.
But as American culture is digging its claws into Italian culture you’re starting to see layer cakes and American-style cheesecakes in Italy, which I consider nonsense. I want to see Italy deviate and expand their dessert repertoire on their own without appropriating American desserts. American desserts are everywhere and Italy already has such a nice foundation to expand upon.
Is there anything particularly Italian that you wish more Americans would adopt here?
Renato: Oh, one hundred percent. I wish I could have a standup bar or something along that vein like they do in Italy where you can stop in throughout the day for a quick espresso. I love that as part of Italian culture, but this is not that culture here. Americans are stubborn and they want it the way they want it. We've been raised that way. So it is great in Italy, and they'll enjoy it when they're in Italy, yes. But if you if asked people to incorporate that culture into your everyday life here you can’t. I have to work. I have to have my laptop, I need my to-go coffee. That’s just how it is.
There are so many cultures here that influence American culture, so as an American you can cherry-pick your favorite aspects of each one and create a kind of new culture just for yourself.
I love how you call the Italian breakfast of cappuccino and cornetto the BEC of Italy. You also sell an Italian-inspired takes on the BEC here at Ciao, Gloria. How do you feel about that dichotomy of giving the people what the want, but with your own Italian touch?
Renato: You can have it all. That’s, like, our tagline here. It’s what I really intended with Ciao, Gloria. If you want to lean American, we have plenty of American things for you. You can lean Italian. Or you can meet halfway.
You were the co-owner, of course, of the popular Baked in Red Hook, Brooklyn, which was, for the most part, firmly ensconced in American classics with cupcakes, black and white cookies, Rice Krispies Treats, layer cakes. During your time there did you long to make and present more Italian items?
Renato: With Baked I got to explore American baked goods, which is really a misnomer because it’s influenced by many other things—it’s German, French, Italian, and so much more. Every once in a while I would throw in an Italian-influenced dessert like the Tricolore. That was my doing. I really wanted to have that there because it’s something I grew up with. It’s something technically American but made by an Italian, you know? Yet even though we think of it as Italian it doesn’t exist in Italy. So I respected the fact that Baked was an American bakery and was really laser-focused on trying to grow it in that way. I had years and years of thought with me being like, oh, if I could do this again, what would I do? So this [Ciao, Gloria] is me doing it again with what I would've done.
BTS on the Making of Dolci!
You call the recipes in Dolci! a mashup of Italian flavors with American innovation. How do you think an Italian nonna would feel about most of these interpretations of Italian recipes?
Renato: I have my mom’s approval, but of course, she’s my mom. But I’m excited in a sense to see how people respond to the book, including nonnas. I do think that there is a nice mix of classic recipes and new recipes. I mean, they might shrug at a couple of things but for the most part I think they’ll approve.
You like to say that Ciao, Gloria is a bakery with a decidedly Italian accent, and I love that while it stands on its own, Dolci! serves as the unofficial Ciao, Gloria cookbook. Is that accurate?
Renato: I would say yes because there recipes that were developed and made specifically for Ciao, Gloria that are in this book. Like the Morning Gloria and the Banana Nutella Snack Cake and other things we have here. So if you’re a fan of Ciao, Gloria, this book is for you.
You’ve co-authored four successful Baked cookbooks, but you call Dolci! your “solo album.” Keeping that figurative sense of singer-songwriter and literal baker-author, what does that mean to you from a creative perspective?
Renato: I threw my whole self into this and this is very reflective of who I am and it’s my voice which I didn’t really get to do with the Baked books; it was always filtered through Matt’s writing. I never had that kind of frontline contact that I wanted. So I had that opportunity with Dolci! and I really wanted to take advantage of that this could by my first book as a solo writer, or it could be my last book as a solo writer. I wanted to make sure I put everything into this.
Like George Harrison’s All Things Must Pass after he left The Beatles. But I agree that anyone writing their first book has to consider it could be your only chance.
Renato: Yeah, you never know. You put your heart into it. It’s my alpha and omega. I don’t consider myself a writer, first and foremost. I like to write cookbooks but I struggle greatly with writing. It’s always a challenge for me. But fortunately with this book I had help from Casey [Elsass]. He calls himself a cookbook doula and he helped me produce this. He kept me on track. He assisted in recipe development. He helped me finesse recipe headnotes. He’s kind of the angel of Brooklyn restaurant cookbooks right now because everyone I know writing a cookbook has Casey involved in their corner.
And he’s working on his own book now.
Renato: Yeah, he is. I just went to the photo shoot yesterday.
And did Kevin [Miyazaki] shoot all the photos?
Renato: He did.
How did you break down all the research and studio photography as I know that can be so overwhelming?
Renato: I was in Italy a couple summers ago and it was part vacation and part research trip—I met up with Casey and we traveled around together, from Sicily to up north to Milan. Kevin worked independently in Italy. He and I did research and went to different cities and hit up specific bakeries together and then developed a punch list that he visited on his own to shoot. Then he spent two weeks traveling from Sicily to Milan and I met up with him for about five days in Rome. Then we did all the studio shots of the finished recipes over a seven-day shoot here in New York, in the Fashion District.
If we were looking at the mood board for Dolci! right now what are some things that would jump out?
Renato: I really wanted to capture an almost escapist type cookbook but in a very subdued way. I didn’t want a ton of people in it, but more scenes of Italy—solitude and quiet beauty. And I wanted that translated into the on-location and studio photography. I wanted it to evoke Italy and a little bit of Italian culture, but in a clean, modern way.
Bring on the Baked Goods
Thinking about some of the recipes in the book that caught my eye and I look forward to making at home, I wanted to pick a few to get your take on them. Since I firmly believe in the idea of cake or pie for breakfast I wanted to start with the ciambella. In Dolci! and here at Ciao, Gloria you feature blueberries in the cake. Is that your take on Americanizing a ciambella?
Renato: Yeah. The Americanization of that particular recipe was first, that it’s an amalgam of two recipes we have here—the olive oil cake and the ciambella. Here, the ciambella, which means morning, is interpreted as a seasonal bunt because we change up the flavor profile each season. Last season it was poppy seed and now it’s blueberry. But for the book I decided to incorporate olive oil into it to give I a more robust, interesting flavor. And blueberries, I think, are an innately American and breakfasty type of berry. Then we add a bit of honey for some sweetness in the glaze which is not typically Italian. Throwing in the blueberries but still having a citrus-based olive oil cake is, for me, a perfect marriage.
And while I know it has nothing to do with Italy directly—well, I guess it does with the Nutella—but I’m thrilled, as you promised you would, included your Nutella Pumpkin Loaf in the book. I’m so excited whenever it comes back every fall. It’s a huge favorite of Ed Anderson, who is the photographer for my own books. That’s a banger.
Renato: It’s just so good and it’s so delicious. You don’t really think that combo would go well together but it does. Pumpkin bread, in general, is one of my favorite kind of American things. Autumn is my favorite season for baked goods.
The Black and White Cookie is a very American baked good, but it’s also synonymous with New York, especially Brooklyn. But they’re often really bad when you actually eat one.
Renato: They’re usually awful
But you’ve taken this Italian American cookie and Italian-ized it a bit.
Renato: In the sense of the actual cake itself, yes. Adding those elements—honey, lemon, and ricotta. It’s a subtly Italian-ized cookie.
Rice Krispies Treats were, and still are, a mainstay of Baked. They were big, brick-like confections.
Renato: Yes. You could build a house with them!
And in Dolci! you have a Tiramisu version of this very American confection.
Renato: Yes! You mix in a rum-based coffee and there’s a little bit of mascarpone in it as well.
Since Baked you’ve been known for your Tricolore, or Rainbow, cookies—especially here at Ciao, Gloria, where they’re often decorated in seasonal colors for Christmas, springtime, and Pride Month. For Dolci! you’ve not only changed your usual Neapolitan flavored Tricolore but also transformed the cookie into a supersized loaf.
Renato: I already had the Tricolore in book one of the Baked books, but it was the Baked version. There was a chocolate-almond layer, a plain layer, and then an orange-infused layer to kind of mimic the Baked colors. And we cut them in rounds. And in book four I had a Tricolore Cake. So I couldn’t do either of those in Dolci! But the Spumoni flavor of chocolate, cherry, and pistachio is so inherently Italian. And it’s so festive looking! I love the idea of making a loaf that you could just cut a giant wedge out of. Just pop it out of the pan and slice it up like it’s a meatloaf. The best meatloaf you could ever have.
Not to keep bringing up Baked but I will always associate the use of malt in many of their baked goods, especially as it’s one of my favorite flavorings. In Dolci! you have a Malted Tiramisu which definitely has my full attention. Is it the malt alone that takes this to the next level?
Renato: I would say it’s a delicious tiramisu on its own. But adding the malt to the espresso and rum adds a depth of flavor that makes you think, oh this is really good, and then you realize, oh, it’s malt. It kind of elevates it in a weird way. It really pairs well with the ingredients that already make a great tiramisu.
I know some of the desserts from the book are hiding in plains sight here at Ciao Gloria. Do you plan to feature more behind the bakery counter once the book comes out?
Renato: Totally. We’ll start rolling out the hits from the book for sure.
What are your plans once the book drops next Tuesday?
Renato: I’ll be doing a bit of a book tour throughout the Northeast with a few stops on the West Coast. I’d love for the book to have a longer life so after this summer’s initial promotional push I hope to do more in the fall and around the holidays.
And is there an Italy trip in the works anytime soon?
Renato: I’m too busy. I can say this because it’s now official but I’m building out a restaurant across the street from Ciao, Gloria. A nice, or fine, casual pasta place.
It’s the Tom Douglas restaurant model to keep all your businesses within walking distance.
Renato: The only reason I took this space was because I could see it from here, you know? But this is as far as I go in terms of expansion plans.
Recipe: Peaches and Cream Semifreddo
Biting into a ripe summer peach can be transportive, and I don’t just feel that way because of Call Me by Your Name. Peach season in Italy means every gelateria and granita cart will be pushing sweet pesca treats, and this peaches and cream semifreddo is my ode to that time of year. Here, peaches are cooked down to release their sweetness and folded into a custardy, creamy base. Semifreddo, as its name literally means, is only half-frozen, to something like the texture of an ice cream cake. It’s cool and refreshing, especially topped with even more peaches for the best kind of seasonal celebration.
Makes 1 9-inch (23 cm) semifreddo
FOR THE SEMIFREDDO
Diced Peaches (4-5 Peaches) (300 grams | 3-1/2 cups)
Granulated Sugar (65 grams, plus 100 grams | 5 tablespoons, plus 1/2 cup)
Fresh Lemon Juice (5 grams | 1 teaspoon)
Large Egg (2)
Large Egg Yolks (3)
Heavy Cream, Cold (345 grams | 1-1/2 cups)
Elderflower Syrup (optional) (12 grams | 2 tablespoons)
FOR THE TOPPING
Sliced Peaches (1-2 Peaches) (85 grams | 1/2 cup)
Granulated Sugar (25 grams | 2 tablespoons)
Fresh Lemon Juice (5 grams | 1 teaspoon)
MAKE THE SEMIFREDDO
Line a 9 by 5-inch (23 by 13 cm) loaf pan with plastic wrap, leaving about 3 inches (8 cm) of overhang on all sides. Set in the freezer to chill.
In a medium saucepan, combine the peaches, 65 grams (5 tablespoons) of the sugar, and the lemon juice. Cook over medium-low heat, stirring often, until the sugar dissolves and the mixture starts to bubble. Continue to cook, stirring occasionally, until the peaches release their juices and the mixture begins to thicken, about 10 minutes. Transfer to a medium bowl to cool for 30 minutes. Cover with plastic wrap and refrigerate for 2 hours until chilled.
Fill a medium saucepan with 2 inches (5 cm) of water and bring to a simmer over medium heat. Set a heatproof medium bowl over the saucepan, making sure the bowl doesn’t touch the water. Add the eggs and egg yolks and remaining sugar and whisk constantly until the mixture is pale and thick, 5 to 8 minutes. It should fall off the whisk in slow ribbons and suspend on the surface for a few seconds. Remove the bowl from the saucepan and set aside to cool for 30 minutes. Cover with plastic wrap and refrigerate for 1 hour until chilled.
When the yolk mixture is fully chilled, in a stand mixer fitted with the whisk, beat the heavy cream and elderflower syrup (if using) over medium speed until stiff peaks form, about 5 minutes. Fold the whipped cream into the yolk mixture in three parts, until no streaks remain. Add one-third of the cooled peaches and fold to combine.
Transfer the mixture into the frozen loaf pan, then spoon the remaining peach mixture over the top. Cover with the plastic overhang, pressing onto the surface of the peaches. Freeze for 4 hours or overnight.
WHEN THE SEMIFREDDO IS FREEZING, MAKE THE TOPPING
In a small saucepan, combine the peaches, sugar, and lemon juice. Set over low heat, stirring constantly, until the sugar dissolves and starts to bubble, about 2 minutes. Transfer to a small bowl to cool for 30 minutes, then cover with plastic wrap and refrigerate for at least 2 hours or until the semifreddo is ready.
Uncover the semifreddo and invert onto a serving plate. Discard the plastic wrap. Spoon the chilled peach topping over the semifreddo before serving.
The semifreddo can be wrapped in plastic and stored in the freezer for up to 1 week.
From DOLCI! by Renato Poliafito with Casey Elsass. Copyright © 2024 by Renato Poliafito. Excerpted by permission of Alfred A. Knopf, a division of Penguin Random House LLC. All rights reserved. No part of this excerpt may be reproduced or reprinted without permission in writing from the publisher.
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Great interview! And his book Dolci is really terrific as well - I was really amazing what a great job he did with the book : )
Loved the interview, can't wait to see the book but: I am totally confused by the ingredient 'dried peaches.' Especially when the instructions say cook them until they release their juices. How can any dried fruit have juice? What am I missing? Thanks!